Ihit
70
Clan Wars: Discussion
Warriors! We are currently working on brand new clan wars which many of you are waiting for eagerly. We want to make these new changes so that event would be interesting and fair to everyone. Few words on how we're expecting the new clan wars to look.
Main changes from the previous format of Clan Wars:
1) All wars will start twice a week - at 21:00 on Wednesdays and 16:00 Saturdays.
2) Duration of wars reduced to 2 hours.
3) If clan wants to participate in a war Clan Leader or someone with necessary permissions needs to press button "We want to Fight" in diplomacy tab no less than 24 hours before the start.
4) Enemy is chosen automatically using several variables to make the fights as balanced as possible while avoiding putting two same clans one against each other too often. Until the start of war you do not know who you'll fight.
5) Requirements and fight mechanics in general will stay unchanged. However new events like "destroy a caravan with ammunition" that will reward extra points and consumables might be added. Contribution and Seal of Defeat removed completely.
6) If you pressed button that you want to participate in next War day you cannot cancel your participation.
7) Heroism rewards will be doubled from previous wars.
Rewards: Heroism for fights as well as bonus points for most active members in them. Sydian and clan reputation as well as some other rewards. While little bit less than winners losers will also receive both Sydian and Clan Reputation! However only winners will be rewarded with Heroism. It will all depend on your own activity!
From our point of view only few active clans were constantly participating in wars and we'd like to see that changed with new format of Clan Wars and for it to stay active even after first month of changes. We are discussing idea(-s) regards to making clans into full fledged Alliances with Alliance chats while decreasing maximum number of players that can be in clan. But we'd like to hear your feedback on this first!
Main changes from the previous format of Clan Wars:
1) All wars will start twice a week - at 21:00 on Wednesdays and 16:00 Saturdays.
2) Duration of wars reduced to 2 hours.
3) If clan wants to participate in a war Clan Leader or someone with necessary permissions needs to press button "We want to Fight" in diplomacy tab no less than 24 hours before the start.
4) Enemy is chosen automatically using several variables to make the fights as balanced as possible while avoiding putting two same clans one against each other too often. Until the start of war you do not know who you'll fight.
5) Requirements and fight mechanics in general will stay unchanged. However new events like "destroy a caravan with ammunition" that will reward extra points and consumables might be added. Contribution and Seal of Defeat removed completely.
6) If you pressed button that you want to participate in next War day you cannot cancel your participation.
7) Heroism rewards will be doubled from previous wars.
Rewards: Heroism for fights as well as bonus points for most active members in them. Sydian and clan reputation as well as some other rewards. While little bit less than winners losers will also receive both Sydian and Clan Reputation! However only winners will be rewarded with Heroism. It will all depend on your own activity!
From our point of view only few active clans were constantly participating in wars and we'd like to see that changed with new format of Clan Wars and for it to stay active even after first month of changes. We are discussing idea(-s) regards to making clans into full fledged Alliances with Alliance chats while decreasing maximum number of players that can be in clan. But we'd like to hear your feedback on this first!
Much of this could probably be solved if there was no gear damage during war like there is no gear damage during dot. I bet a lot more players would even fight HF and Elitists if only they weren't going to have to spend 20g in repairs. twice a week. Just a thought.
Now please, launch some wars! We all agree that we Want wars back. We all agree that we Want to see this new system, as recommended asap, and we'll all have opinions on it after the first couple wars go.
Waterhawke,
There's no gear damage in Sea Battles, and I have already told my clan to save up for Charms. Yes, removing gear damage would be great, but I don't think it'll change the opinions of people that already avoid playing against Elitists/HF/Ninth.
Wouldn't that make wars somewhat pointless then what's the point of trying to get online players-more players in clan/get better then? Also you answered your next paragraphs first question with this why we were looking at splitting clans into more smaller ones into the first place.
As far as splitting clans it is very unlikely to happen now due to feedback of players as mentioned before.
Also Alliances not getting matched was in regards if we'd split clan into smaller ones in current state of clans it's not yet decided if they will/won't get matched.
Time-wise we'll see if we can move it to different day not to overlap with DoT, currently i see only suggestions to move it to Thursday. Wouldn't you want it to be Tuesday instead as Invincible Warrior while not popular is on Thursdays?
Heroism for losers - unlikely, you still get Sydian and Clan Reputation that will depend on your buffs/consumables/general activity and most likely personal gains for players.
Punishment for not fighting - i don't know if this should be a thing, rather should encourage people fight possibly giving people doing those quests and getting points through "old system" you know more rewards. So participation = fluff. We're also looking as some possibility to encourage participation with offering no gear damage (this one if added won't be completely "free" though)
Could be wrong since my eyesight has been going and I haven't gotten glasses yet but I thought people have been suggesting Tuesday rather than Thursday. Either way yes I like the Tuesday idea better than Wednesday and Thursday.
Redesign the aspect crystals thing. A clan can get tons of crystals by just getting the mines before the others, then stalling the fights while the miner keeps mining. In a 2 hour war, this will count A LOT.
I would remove the whole mining of crystals thing.
Have 6-7 locations similar to DOT. In each location only a certain bracket can fight between themselves in the war.
For every win, crystals are rewarded according to damage. Top damage from both sides gets a bonus. Losing side gets only 30 % of the crystals of the winning side.
At the end of the war if no clan managed to get a certain limit of crystals, create a big fight where top 10 players w.r.t. to damage can fight against each other and the winners win the war. This fight has bonus heroism for winners.
All fights in the DOT-like locations are without supremacy buffs. Only the final fight has supremacy.
With the new war system (my ideas or not), winning a clan war is irrelevant as you don't win/lose money. Only the fights matter.
About not fighting in a war even if you pressed I want to fight: it's fair to stop the possibility to join the wars for a certain period of time. a minimum total clan damage/players have to be reached in order to declare that a clan did fight in the war.
About war times: Allow 3 war times every day in the Maze time which is perfect for everyone. Being every day, clans can decide to just not go on DOT time.
Allow queueing for war and time frame 24 hrs before war until 6 hrs before war. On 6 hrs before war, announce both clans that war is starting up. Let's do not make people wait until the start time to actually see if they have a war or not.
Great point is that contributions will be obsolete, which made many little clans suffer.
Just a little think-about:
Reputation sensitive players will more focus on wars again for getting valor and heroism instead of participating in events, arenas or seabattles.
I know that the activity there isn't high anyway but I'd assume that it raised a bit since the wars were deactivated (to be proven by admins).
So maybe other PVP should be enhanced as well to not let it die again.
The no gear damage is a great suggestion.
Read my latest reply in regards to that.
This will be very good in wars, overall I like the adds to war. I do think there will be some that no matter what is done, they will object.
Agreed. I'm tired of trying to convince people to fight.
No gear damage, like in SB/etc combined with good participation awards feels like the best hope for fixing this or at least discouraging it. People are willing to take a beating in arena on battle steel because the cost is much lower and it helps them to catch up on reps.
I can't recall what the valor rewards are like for war, but if there is no heroism for lost fights, perhaps better-than-average valor in a lost fight (somewhere between lost arena and lost dot)?
Double heroism in a win is intriguing for this. Even in wars where you get slaughtered, you wind up with a few fights that you win for whatever reason.
I will be curious to see how the matchmaking is done. If it's by level, great, there are lots of level 3 clans that can battle and grow. If it's by reputation, we'll see the same 2-3 wars over and again. Not really complaining, just curious what to expect.
Looking forward to details on sydian, a finalized schedule, and a button to click.
*brushes off his dancin shoes*
[There are my personal thoughts]
So, since the administration is working to get more people involved in these upcoming wars I believe that the best way to go about them is alliances. However, many people are discouraging the idea because they will be separated from their clan. Well, you said that the idea of alliances is very unlikely because of the opposition in both servers so this goes back to the main point on how to get more people to participate. If the system we have now (with current clans) is left as it is, nothing will change and people will remain to be inactive.
So, my solution is: instead of decreasing the amount of people in a clan, the administration should slightly (and accordingly) increase the amount of people in a clan (or leave it the same) so this way the alliance system can be incorporated in the clans system. For example, a clan will be allowed to have (let's say) 5 alliances under it, and each alliance will have 10 people.
If this is done, most people would argued against the alliance system will be relived to know that they will not be separated, instead they will remain under the same clan even though they will have different alliance symbols (or whatever). Players can continue their daily relationship with their clan, and others will not have to worry about being kicked out or having to start over in another clan. Oh, it'd be a good idea to leave clan rep and chests contents untouched. I'd suggest making an alliance rep that increases the amount of sydian dropped and heroism (maybe make it so that after 1k the loser would receive 1/10 of the heroism, not to leave Rubi's wonderful idea out) to further ensure the participation of alliances in these wars. Also, there will be multiple leaders under a clan apart from the clan leader as each alliance will receive a leader for alliance. Also, it would be good to have an alliance hall with smaller chests designed for each alliance as some players have been looking for more space (two-birds with one stone, well, more like multiple birds).
Well, you get the point. Its complicated because I can think of so much and dont want to make a full detail post about it.
Everyone else let me know what you think of this system and/or improvements that can be made.
1.) I am a big fan of Ihit's post that admins are considering removing gear damage from clan wars. I know that from a personal standpoint, one of the thoughts that would cross my mind when deciding to give up on particularly difficult wars is "well, I think I've broken enough gear for one day", so getting rid of that factor seems great.
2.) As for punishment for not fighting, I am not a fan whatsoever. I recall wars where we've had great turnout and lots of fighting and others where we've had very few show. It happens. People have lives and are busy. Maybe that means I should check more closely with members before pressing the "declare" button, but my feeling is that having a few people fighting is better than none fighting, so I dislike the idea of a clan being punished for not meeting some sort of a threshold for participation.
3.) One thing that I think these changes don't really fix is the tendency of players to flight towards the strongest clans (and maybe this isn't something that can be fixed, or isn't something that should be addressed through changes to wars). If I'm honest, this is a good thing for 9th Legion because we've historically been one of the toughest Vaalor clans in wars, and thus a likely destination for vaalorians who seek heroism. However, it feels bad for the game, since it seems like the game overall would be better served by letting lots of clans thrive and gain heroism/sydian/whatever other rewards. We have lots of places where clans work as teams and gain big advantaged for doing so. Sydian mines, DoT, Sea Battles, BC fights, etc. It feels a little bit silly to suggest that "Clan Wars" could be a place where this is not the case, but I'm going to throw it out as an idea anyways. What if individual players could queue instead of clans and the game randomized teams, stacking 20v20 or something onto teams that fought instead of clans? It seems like this might also address some of the earlier posts about not wanting to fight elitists and get pounded, etc. Just a thought...everyone please feel free to flame it.
Looking forward to new wars, however they end up looking!
-Lance-
I think a small amount for heroism to the losing clan will make hole wars a lot more interesting. (if brought to sb more vaalor would go more. I know i would again) War on Wednesday i work till 6-7 so i don't make many but i agree with most move the time on wed and sat so it doesn't interfere with dot. 2 hr time i like, the button option to war or not i like.
"Enemy is chosen automatically using several variables to make the fights as balanced as possible while avoiding putting two same clans one against each other too often." sounds good to me.
my only thoughts on clans that will hide the hole time and not fight i understand life will get in the way for some so what about a 3 strike system and not to 1 or 2 ppl but the hole clan if admins see that most of the clan has logged before war vs same clan 3 times in a row maybe give them a curse that no one can heal or take away hop till next war.
This is just my thoughts to help with game if you don't agree i don't care i won't be posting back to any the want to talk **** on my post. Now let's get wars going again
Ihit
That's not what I meant. In all regard, clans and players need, should get stronger; I'm certainly not opposing to players and clans getting better.
Yes, a clan's numbers and might are definitely important in determining the outcome of war, and should stay in the new war system. What I'm saying here is to not purely assess clan war success/victory based on these two factors. If so, the same old clans will win and the losers never get to grow nor even get a chance to be better. There should be other determinants involved to allow everyone have a fighting chance.
Regards
LV
You do matter...same as everyone in game does...but if there was a clan war time set for your part of the world, what server time would that equate to and how many would be online? Rather than complain about time of something, why not suggest a time that would work better for you guys AND would also work for when MOST players are online?
1. Wars are shortened, or likely to be to 2h, so how many fights do you think someone will actually get into in that time? At best I would suggest about 10-15...at best. So if 10-15 fights then how much gear can be broken in a war? No different to arena...and there are always charms of durability to grab for people.
2. If a clan declares to fight then they should do exactly that, assumedly the clan will have discussed beforehand if they are ready and want to fight. If they don't fight then there should be some form of warning system or penalty.
3. If you want to see the best individual players then I point you in the direction of either the vortex or IW lol. Clan wars are meant to be exactly that.
Lady Violet,
Disagree. the whole point to getting better on an individual and a clan basis is to win. In wars there is strategy and also numbers that count, so does power. So there are ways to win for all clans. Example; if we fought with 20 online, against a clan with 50 online then we would lose. So if a clan really wants a war then they should buckle up and get people online.
Many have complained about reducing clan numbers down from 50....do you really have 50 active members? I don't think so.